Moving at the Speed of Creativity

There are currently 16 responses to “Podcast260: EduBloggerCon 2008, Intellectual Property and Recording: A Conversation with Elaine Roberts of Pearson”

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1. 1 On June 29th, 2008, Christian Long said:

   Appreciated this podcast, Wes, as well as your original and follow-up blog posts that led to your sitting down with Dr. Roberts.

   While I disagree — a bit — with the assumption that Pearson is invested in EduBloggerCon simply because the ideas are catching their attention (there is a definite for-profit and ownership principle on the floor or Pearson would have NO interest in retaining/repackaging data), I do appreciate the tone of your efforts and neutral engagement with Dr. Roberts.

   I do have one Q, however.

   In the podcast — at the very end — you asked her if there was a place on the Pearson site where bloggers/educators could offer “feedback” (one assumes about the issue at NECC). She never answered.

   Why?

   Was there a place/link that she offered you later? Or was this a subtle indicator that htey are still very traditional in their expectation of ownership/publication that somehow ’slipped into’ the podcast.

   Curious.

   Again, thanks for your tone/efforts.

2. 2 On June 30th, 2008, Wesley Fryer said:

   Christian: Thanks for the feedback. She indicated there is NOT presently a place for feedback and interaction with Pearson. Hopefully their involvement with the EduBloggerCon community will encourage them to embrace social media and provide places for educators to provide feedback. As someone said in our subsequent panel, one of the easiest things they could do is provide a place for all teachers who use the same textbook to connect with each other in a learning community. I personally think Pearson should hire someone to be their director of social media, to create and manage these spaces. This is something that I think should become a best practice for companies in the 21st century. From what I understand, feedback Michael Dell received from the Dell website led to the company offering Linux pre-installed on Dell computers. Dell listened to the community, and this benefited both the company and their consumers. The same could prove true for Pearson and other traditional textbook companies.

3. 3 On June 30th, 2008, Bill Fitzgerald said:

   Hello, Wes,

   This is an interesting podcast in many ways. It will be interesting to see if and how these videos are released (and as Dr. Roberts says, Pearson will be shooting approx 26 hours of video over the course of NECC), and under what license. I’m somewhat surprised that the negotiations re the videos being shot in the first place didn’t include licensing terms — in planning for future EduBloggerCons, it would be great to specify that all video shot needs to be released within a certain amount of time under some type of CC license. I suspect that such terms would go a long way toward alleviating mistrust.

   And I would also like to echo Christian’s sentiment re your neutral tone. I would love to see movement from within Pearson (or any textbook company) toward a more open licensing structure that moved away from the “content as commodity” model, and into a model that allowed for freer reuse and modification.

4. 4 On June 30th, 2008, Dean Shareski said:

   Wes,

   My issue with Pearson was more with the way they impacted the spirit of the gathering. The intimacy and energy of passionate educators was lost as they quickly became the focus early on. I’m likely too naive or uninterested in their agenda but again, I was felt it set a negative tone for the day that was hard to overcome. Not sure what the solution was and in part I would blame myself for not making the day more what I wanted. That’s about personal responsibility which is entrenched in the unconference format. This was also not Pearson’s fault either. Steve gave them the go ahead. Given that Pearson will eventually profit from this, a nice gesture may have been to supply coffee and muffins for us. That may have been perceived as a peace offering. Either way, large boom mics and video cameras made conversations a bit stilted. At least for me.

5. 5 On June 30th, 2008, Wesley Fryer said:

   Dean: As I mentioned at the end of the day, I think it would have been reasonable for us to ask for a quid-pro-quo from Pearson. They were certainly getting valuable ideas and content from “us,” so it was and is reasonable to ask for something in return. In addition to food and refreshments, as Bill suggested the licensing terms of recorded content should also be negotiated and be done openly. I don’t fault Steve H for this, but I think it is something which should be discussed and changed for next year. I think this should go one of two ways: Either no recording is permitted at all by anyone, or people who are proposing and leading unconference sessions should decide if they want to permit recording and sharing. If the sharing is going to be done on a commercial basis, then that goes into a different category than the noncommercial sharing.

6. 6 On June 30th, 2008, Christian Long said:

   Been mulling a few assumptions and questions in my head since first commenting last night. Here is the big picture of what I’m thinking through:

   Ultimately, this is not about ownership. This is a matter of communication.

   First, on a very practical level, someone/org needed to organize (Steve H.) or offset the costs of (Pearson?) the use of space, power, equipment, furniture, schedule, planning, et al of the “EduBloggerCon”. No conference/hotel is going to give away any of the above no matter how much “open-source” and “2-way convo” semantics are thrown around by participating bloggers (et al). It would be naive to question any company (such as Pearson) being involved or any person/org (Steve H.) putting it together ahead of time to his/its professional benefit. Bloggers/Teachers may want it to remain a free-sharing atmosphere, but someone’s got to keep the lights on and send out the invites.

   Second, anytime an event shifts from a relatively “impromptu” meet-up to an “anticipated” performance due to popularity and Google Juice, the grass roots warm-fuzzies are going to be replaced with a bit of impersonal mechanization in future years. This feeling will be magnified if you have a combo of original evangelists (who helped inspire/legitimize it year one) and anxious newbies (who heard about it virtually the first time around, eager to see it F2F the second time) coming together…as well as the sudden arrival of an corporate outsider.

   Given these 2 assumptions/reflections, I can’t help but wonder what all the fuss is about. “EduBloggerCon” would NOT even have existed had Steve H. not pulled the organizational levers; likewise, it only makes sense from a professional (yes, teachers: that word has many connotations!) point of view to solidify and off-set the costs of the event through partnership. Anyone that has a problem with lack of warm-fuzzies in v2.0 of “EduBloggerCon” is either waxing nostalgic or naively.

   Or maybe not.

   As I said above, this is not an issue of ownership.

   It is, however, a matter of communication.

   Skipping the but-it-doesn’t-feel-good-to-me reactions that any person is allowed to have, there isn’t much value in charging Pearson (directly) or Steve H. (indirectly, although I’m struck by the nearly non-existent conversation by fellow-bloggers/’colleagues’ to request that Steve H. throw his voice into the mix, esp. given any expected/potential/assumed professional/proprietary/financial gain on his part) with tarnishing the nostalgic nature of our collective memory of year one of “EduBloggerCon”.

   On the other hand, this is a profound opportunity for talking about communication. Intentions matter little if there aren’t clear statements ahead of time and after the fact. Likewise, legal details, publication promises, competitive leverage, and signed agreements/releases matter little if the very evangelists in question are being talked around (or ignored).

   Having listened a second time to Dr. Roberts’ replies to Wes’ questions, I could not help but hear the standard business response (mix defensive marketing posture with standard legal prep) in her answers. There was a great deal of instinctive focus on why Pearson had a right to be there and how it behooves them (as the largest educational publisher on the planet, paraphrasing Dr. Roberts) to pay attention to something like “EduBloggerCon” (hence, why she/Pearson approached Steve H. to get involved/record/edit/publish). On the other hand, there was very little acknowledgment of what the majority of “EduBloggerCon” participants/fans wanted to hear:

   “We respect what you’re doing. We’d like your input on how we use/share the recordings we’re making. We understand that traditional business practices may run counter to the spirit of blogger meet-up’s like this…and we want to find a way to learn with/from you. Yes, we need to off-set our investment (time/resources), but we also want to ensure that we remain a legit ‘partner’ in this evolving educational/2-way publication landscape. Oh, by the way [in a nod to Dean S. above], we’d like to offer all participants/audience members a complimentary breakfast and invite anyone interested to participate in a series of discussions and virtual forums over the next year to flesh out some of the most salient ideas. Please let us know if you’d like to be involved. And thank you for letting us join the conversation.”

   Or something of that spirit.

   I suspect that if anyone listened to the podcast in full (once, twice, more), they’d hear little of that in her literal answers or tone of voice. Likewise, I have a great deal of respect for Wes’s tone/optimism, but I also wonder why the Q’s came across more like underhand softball tosses than honest professional inquiry based on some legitimate concerns by a wide range of participants and distant viewers/listeners alike.

   As I hinted at above, I’m also very surprised that Steve H. (a man I respect and have enjoyed F2F time with in the past; a guy who has been consistently weaving together a formal network of educators the world round through a variety of digital tools) has not been asked to a) explain/defend the original contract, b) his communication before/during/after this year’s “EduBloggerCon”, and c) how he’d like Pearson/himself to go forward to maintain everyone’s faith in his/their judgment.

   Again, this is not an issue of ownership. It is, however, a real issue of communication.

   Claiming, “We have a right because…”, will only alienate. Choosing, instead, to listen and to honestly respond with humility will create fans and allies.

   And we’re all better for the 2nd option.

   Respectfully, I look forward to this comment thread’s evolution, as well as hearing more from Steve H. and Pearson as time unfolds.

7. 7 On June 30th, 2008, John Pederson said:

   I tried listening to this with an open mind. It only made me more frustrated.

   Sylvia Martinez also did an interesting interview with Elaine Roberts from Pearson.

   (Sylvia)
   Here’s what I’d like to know about this recording:
   * What Pearson products is this video intended to be used in?
   * Beyond this product, do I have any assurance of where the video will end up? Does Pearson own it outright or only for this limited use?
   * Who else (corporate partners, etc) will they share the video with and do I have any control of that?
   * Will this video be used for marketing or promotion for the company?
   * Will my name be shown on the video or used for promotional purposes?
   * Will I be able to see the final result and final edited version to be sure that I agree with your edits of what I say?
   * Will the video taken that day be given back to the NECC/Edublogger community so everyone can share it equally?

   Sylvia Martinez

   (Elain Roberts)
   Great questions and comments.

   * You are correct in that there may be an implication that you are endorsing Pearson products. But it’s also important for you to know we are not promoting any Pearson product. Though most of the books in our graduate courses are Pearson, not all of them are Pearson books. We don’t ask any of classroom teachers to change their curriculum, their lesson plans, their resources. We may sure we complete our due diligence to get permission from whomever to show their materials–posters, curriculum, textbooks, trade books, etc.–in our classroom video.
   * We are shooting video for our graduate content courses. We work with universities, schools, and districts to deliver the graduate level content as stand-alone courses, Master’s programs, or professional development as site-based, blended, or online. We can license the content or host it; facilitiate it or not. We have a menu of services we can offer to universities, schools, and districts.
   * We own the content outright because we want to exert some degree of control if we license our content to others. We have a responsibility to protect the classroom teachers and students who appear in any of our classroom footage.
   * BTW, if the interview does not go as the interviewee had hoped or if the classroom teaching situation isn’t what the teacher wanted or liked, we don’t use the footage. I will not embarrass anyone. There are no director’s cuts, no outtakes.
   * If you give permission for us to use your interview, your name and credentials will be shown in the video.
   * The video will not be used for promotional purposes unless you give us permission to use it that way. Even then, at this point, we are only looking to use some footage to work with Steve Hargadon and NECC to promote their work. If there were possibilities of any other like promotional opportunities, we would ask your permission first.
   * Reviewing final edits can be difficult. We can show you the transcript, I think.
   * No, the video will not be available for the EduBloggerCon community. That goes back to the fact that Pearson will own it outright, but, more importantly, if the video is available to everyone, there are no guarantees how it will be edited or how it will be used, and no guarantees that whoever else has the video will get permission from the individuals for the ways they plan to use the video.

   Elaine Roberts

   Interestingly, this all happened on the Edubloggercon wiki.
   http://www.edubloggercon.com/Pearson+Video+Project

   ——————-

   The following quote really has me interested.

   “The video will not be used for promotional purposes unless you give us permission to use it that way. Even then, at this point, we are only looking to use some footage to work with Steve Hargadon and NECC to promote their work.”

   Question for Steve Hargadon: Do you have some sort of financial arrangement with Pearson?

   If yes, was it disclosed?
   If no, please describe the circumstances that lead to Pearson being involved in Edubloggercon.

8. 8 On June 30th, 2008, Bill Fitzgerald said:

   Like a few other folks in this thread, I am also keeping an open mind on this.

   I also think it bears mentioning that without Steve Hargadon’s stewardship and organization, EduBloggercon, while it might have happened, would likely have been on a much smaller scale. So, @Steve, if you are reading this, thank you for all you have done. Personally, I’m not comfortable with language that, intentionally or otherwise, questions Steve’s role here.

   I also read the discussion on the EduBloggercon wiki a few weeks back, but refrained (until now) from going into details on this. These sections struck me as interesting when I first read them, and as relevant now:

   “We own the content outright because we want to exert some degree of control if we license our content to others.”

   And: “No, the video will not be available for the EduBloggerCon community. That goes back to the fact that Pearson will own it outright, but, more importantly, if the video is available to everyone, there are no guarantees how it will be edited or how it will be used, and no guarantees that whoever else has the video will get permission from the individuals for the ways they plan to use the video.”

   This seems pretty unambiguous to me. From Pearson’s perspective, they own what they shoot, and they will not be releasing it out. In Wes’ podcast, this comes up in response to Wes’ direct question (”How will this video be made available?”) The IP section of the podcast gets moving at about 8:00 minutes, and the core of Dr. Robert’s response is at 8:50 to approx 9:05. Personally, I would have preferred some more precise language from Pearson. I’d be curious what other people think.

   And at the risk of stating the obvious, releasing the video shot at Edubloggercon under a CC-Attribution-Non-Commercial license would be a great service to the community.

   Cheers,

   Bill

9. 9 On June 30th, 2008, Christian Long said:

   Bill — Really appreciate your response. Esp. with regards to Steve H.

   Since I wrote above what most likely inspired you to state, “Personally, I’m not comfortable with language that, intentionally or otherwise, questions Steve’s role here.”, I’ll offer one final thing:

   Steve H. is a leader. Leaders make decisions that affect participants/team members. Leadership is prime for being questions, challenged, respected, and explored. This is not about ‘liking’ someone. Likewise, one can agree that Steve H.’s role was vital — no, central — to the very existence of this year’s “EduBloggerCon”. No argument there.

   That being said, as a leader/founder/entrepreneur that helped make it possible — and invited Pearson to ‘join’ the ‘conversation’ — isn’t it merely a an issue of respect/professionalism to trust him to share his own insights/reflections? And shouldn’t any leader of a community this vibrant, this passionate, this invested, this knowledgeable actually embrace his own colleagues/peers asking him honest/fair questions about something he knows better than everyone else involved?

   Just a thought.

   Remember, both education/learning and democracy demand that friends can ask tough questions of each other. Oh, and both be transformed because of it when done well and in the right spirit.

10. 10 On June 30th, 2008, Bill Fitzgerald said:

    Hello, Christian,

    RE: “Remember, both education/learning and democracy demand that friends can ask tough questions of each other. Oh, and both be transformed because of it when done well and in the right spirit.” — I am in full, 100% agreement. Good questions — like the ones you asked above, and in countless other threads I have had the pleasure of reading — are essential to learning and growth. IMO, real growth often arises from when we have been moved to a place of discomfort, as this can motivate some powerful questioning.

    And, FWIW, it’s less what I saw here, and more what I have seen in other places. The blogosphere has a tendency to eat its own, and it’s not pretty.

11. 11 On June 30th, 2008, Elaine Roberts said:

    I’m delighted with this conversation, so thank you. First, I approached Steve Hargadon and asked if he would be willing to be interviewed. He said he would, but also invited us to come to film EduBloggerCon, which excited my team unimaginably. I think it’s important to note a couple of things. My group creates graduate level courses. We have little to do with the textbook publishing side of the house though, yes, that could change. Our courses are used by universities, schools, districts for individual graduate courses, as part of Master’s degree programs, as professional development. We’ll take those 26 or so of video and distill those to find the moments that best exemplify what we’re trying to help K-12 classroom teachers learn or understand, especially those who are vaguely familiar with the terms “blogs” and “wikis” and think that maybe they should be learning something about them but still confuse the technology with the pedagogy. You folks have said and demonstrated with such eloquence and passion what these teachers (and probably more than a few administrators) need to hear and see and learn.

    Now, Steve might have reconsidered his generous invitation if he had realized how controversial our presence might be. Did we pay him? No. Does Pearson Corporation underwrite NECC? Yes. Were we trying to sell something to the NECC participants? No. Are we hoping to make money by selling our courses to schools and districts? Of course. And we work with universities who help set the tuition rates.

    Of all of that footage–and some marvelous interviews with folks I can never thank enough, we’ll likely use a relatively small percentage in any of the technology courses we’re developing. But I heard material we’ll be able to use in our C&I courses, our leadership courses, and there may even be footage we can use in some of our content courses (reading/literacy, math, science, etc.) We’ll repurpose as much as possible.

    There has been a lot of conversation about making the video and the audio available. I absolutely get that, but I have to be careful about what I promise because a for-profit company has this weird thing about profit. I spent 11 years as a programmer/analyst followed by about the same number of years first teaching computer science and math on the college level, then teaching writing and literature though with a split appointment as I did stay in the technology arena for a while. I’ve been in the corporate environment again for the last 4 years. Things have changed a lot since I worked for Trintex which then became Prodigy.

    My first answers were that Pearson wouldn’t share the content. We’re investing money in the project, intellectual property, competition, etc. All that jazz. I have a responsibility to my company to protect its interests and I’m sure you understand that. But then I was listening to the conversations in EduBloggerCon, realizing that we’re probably not going to reach as many K-12 teachers and administrators as I would like through our courses. Can we reach them through EduBloggerCon? Probably not directly, but clearly most of the participants of EduBloggerCon are passionate folks who see themselves as change agents, but who also see themselves as teachers, not just of their students, but of their colleagues and peers. So how do we push out the words we heard at EduBloggerCon? How do I share the incredible insights of the round table panelists with people who won’t take the courses we design or participate in the professional development we develop with districts? In other words, what can I do to help you evangelize and teach? I can make as much of this video as possible available. That’s why I shared that with Steve in the EduBloggerCon. I’ve got some ideas about distribution, but I’ll have to figure out how to clear some hurdles at the home front to make the video accessible though not repurposable by anyone else. I do have to protect the corporate interests to a certain extent and, to be honest, I’m not quite sure where those lines will be. So that’s why I can’t tell you how the video will be made available. Again, as much as possible, but I can’t yet know the limitations of availability and I’m certainly not at all sure about the vehicle. But I personally will make sure I can do whatever I can to make as much as possible available and to keep you posted on what that means.

    So, there was no contract between Pearson and Steve Hargadon, who graciously agreed to an interview as well. I did give him a bottle of water, but that hardly counts. The folks who participated in the round table were offered our standard honorarium, about which they didn’t know until we were gearing up to start. When asked, they all graciously agreed to give of their time. And then even said “yes” when asked to spend a bit more time with us to do one-on-one interviews.

    I’m quite sure I’ve not answered anyone’s questions to their satisfaction, so I hope this conversation will continue. I suppose I do feel a wee bit compelled to defend Pearson. Pearson Corporation, that largest textbook publisher in the world, had nothing to do with this except for the fact that I represent the company. My corner of the Pearson universe is quite small. This whole marvelous adventure (for me anyway) started when our content developer asked if it might be possible to get some interviews with some individuals at NECC. My project managers met with our senior producer and talked about logistics and if we could pull this off in time as we had a little over a month. So I started sending out emails to individuals trying to explain what we do and what we were trying to do. That’s one of the reasons Steve asked me to post something in the wiki. Again, people responded almost immediately and incredibly graciously and generously.

    I have a great privilege working for Pearson. I do know that companies such as mine do not always have a great reputation. But I also know that a whole bunch of the folks I work with are all about helping teachers improve their craft and are all about helping kids learn. I also believe that companies as large as Pearson want to innovate, but it’s a big ship to turn and there are decades of practice to change. It takes time. My little group is such a smidge of the multibillion dollar revenue of this company, but sometimes, just sometimes, it’s the folks in a position such as mine who can begin to effect change. But I also know there are some strategies that work better at some times than at others. I know, that’s the ambiguous sort of corporatespeak again, but I can’t make any promises. I want to, but I can’t.

    So here’s the deal. I’m going to do whatever I can to make video available. But I think that’s only a small part of what this community might be looking for. When you ask for a place to offer feedback, what is it you really want? Do you want to offer feedback on textbooks? on professional development offerings? There’s quite a panoply of possibilities in the Pearson “book bag,” as many of you well know. But I’d also like to know in what ways you think Pearson (or my part of the company) can support EduBloggerCon and this community, can help you in your work to teach and evangelize, recognizing, please, that we are a for-profit company and there may be a limit to what we can do (for now) in the open source world. And so, in the spirit of things, you might go to http://nomargins.wikispaces.com/Pondering+about+Pearson and let me know what you think. It’s a wiki space I’ve just created–one I’d wanted to do for my self for a while. This isn’t corporate-sponsored. As I said, I still need to figure out how to navigate the barriers and the iceberg, but I will do what I can to disseminate this information to others or to make sure they know of this place so they can see and read for themselves.

    Let me also add my personal and professional thanks to Steve Hargadon. He is man of great integrity and infectioius passion. My thanks also to Wes Fryer for providing this platform for discussion. And many, many, many, many thanks to the round table participants for sharing their passion, their energy, their knowledge, their wisdom and for each of our interviewees. I’ve learned so much from you I can hardly wait for my class this fall.

    Keep talking, please.

    Most respectfully,
    Elaine Roberts

12. 12 On June 30th, 2008, Wesley Fryer said:

    You are right Elaine, this is a good discussion, and I am glad we can have it. Thanks for setting up the wiki, I would also encourage others to contribute ideas there. Elaine has agreed to share the audio from our panel so it can be published as a noncommercial podcast, and that is great news. I didn’t anticipate an opportunity to dialog with Pearson representatives at EduBloggerCon but I am glad this has come about, and I think the chance for ideas from the conference as well as our subsequent panel on Sunday to be shared with as many educators as possible is a great idea.

13. 13 On June 30th, 2008, Christian Long said:

    Dr. Roberts —

    Your comment, ripe with honest insight/explanation and passion for what you do in Pearson (and beyond), has made a huge difference for me in terms of my initial reactions to the podcast you did with Wes (and my comments above). While this conversational thread (and all of the EduBloggerCon dust-up) has nothing to do with whether one guy has changed his opinion of another, I do want to start out with the ‘personal’ admission first.

    Sometimes its easy to get caught up in the ideas/debate and lose sight of the human component along the way. Want to make sure I don’t head full-steam in the wrong direction in spite of good intentions.

    Thank you for your follow-up. I’m impressed with how you’re trying to delicately/appropriately navigate the for-profit realities of your team and the unchartered waters that are in motion with regards to all of our expectations of what can happen in a 2-way conversational publishing realm.

    As a past head of a for-profit school planning/consulting firm that served the educational and corporate arenas around the world, I can say with experience that the balance is tricky at times. I can also say that when we did it right, it was always when we aired on the side of figuring out what our audience was seeking and trying to figure out how our best ideas could be perceived by those outside of our internal planning sessions. Our for-profit necessities often ran counter to our human willingness, but the last few years have demanded that we all get better at re-framing the ‘conversation’ when it comes to sharing ideas and publishing.

    While the larger issues will be at play for quite some time (and Pearson certainly is not ‘the bad guy’), your comments above suggest enormous possibilities when all participants commit to ongoing conversation rather than outright ownership expectations.

    And I have to compliment you on sharing the wiki you just created (as well as for just launching this solo learning project of your own). Great stuff and well deserved of feedback from those who have been curious about Pearson’s involvement with “EduBloggerCon”.

    Again, on a personal level — thank you. On a professional/virtual network level, thank you again. Much to learn on all fronts.

    Sincerely/Cheers,
    Christian

14. 14 On June 30th, 2008, Christian Long said:

    Dr. Roberts — I just added a suggestion to your wiki. Please feel free to contact me directly at your convenience if it needs any clarification. Cheers to your ‘project’! Christian

15. 15 On July 1st, 2008, Laura B. Fogle said:

    Wes, thanks for posting the podcast and keeping the dialogue flowing. And thank you for participating in the round table. I am a tech facilitator at a public elementary school, an occasional blogger and a part time course developer for Dr. Roberts at Pearson. This spring I began working on a course to help teachers learn to use blogs and wikis in their classroom. When my project manager asked me what type of video clips would help my students (other teachers) learn about educational blogs and wikis, your name among others sprang to my mind. “What if my students could hear about the flat classroom straight from Vicki Davis and blogs from Wes Fryer!” I talked excitedly about the people who have inspired me and how it so happened that they would probably all be at the edublogger con in just a few weeks. And that was where the idea to shoot footage was born. I wanted more teachers to be inspired. I can’t wait to share the conversations with my students and see where they take the ideas in their classrooms. Thanks to everyone who took part!

16. 16 On July 1st, 2008, Cheryl Oakes said:

    Laura makes a great point. ” if my students could hear about the flat classroom from Vicki, and blogs from Wes Fryer”, then she suspects her students will be inspired. We all know the power of words and video. We all know the power of listening and reading the struggles people have when figuring out the best way to do things. We all know how hard it is to find the right combination for getting others inspired. I was fortunate enough to be part of the round table. Many of you were fortunate enough to be at EduBloggerCon. For the many folks who were not I hope the video will be shared. Thanks to Wes for his podcast of Elaine Roberts and thanks to Pearson for making the audio available for all. The conversations were rich and will continue.